Is250 Subwoofer

[akuma]

I am pretty sure a lot of you would think that the standard 10" subwoofer has no bass what so ever, and i'm pretty sure there have been many discussions about changing to a better subwoofer.

My question is who has done it in this forum and could someone please take some pics and show us? Any suggestions on the various options to choose from?

I've heard people left the standard sub and put another 12" sub + mono amp before. :P

[FrankyX]

Wow, I am actually quite impressed with the overall sound quality. Rock sounds unreal, beats are crystal clear and bassy tracks are well balanced, every album is obviously produced differently also. Each to their own I guess.

[Sapphire Cam]

Geez Akuma - you're a hard man to please!! :)

In my spare time I do a fair bit of music composing, production and mastering for a number of bands, and I can tell you the standard Pioneer sound system in the is250 is the best 'standard system' Ive ever heard. You can have those overrated Bose car audio systems anyday - even the Harman Kardon that Range Rover are putting in some of their vehicles aren't as good. The subbie in the is250 works beautifully and is matched very well to the other 12 speakers.

Most music-heads dont appreciate this, but a good car audio system should have speakers matched with not only each other, but also the amplifier and the nature of the cabin. Lexus has done this with the Pioneer system, and the Levison one takes it a step further. So many times, people installing after-market systems or alterations get this wrong, as well as a number of car manufacturers who just couldnt care less.

This is where most people get it wrong by replacing certain components of a system. The subwoofer in the is250 has a very tight and balanced response and complements the standard woofers well, which actually if you listen arent as prominent out of the rear as the front, beacuse of what the sub is doing. If you want to go ahead and get one of those "fully sik hetik" massive loud subwoofers, go ahead, but you'll be compromising the overall sound quality of your system, and invariably will end up with a more murky and delayed bass response.

A lot of it can come down to the production of the album/s you're listening to. If they havent mastered with a subwoofer in the studio &/or aren't using sub-bass enhancement software or hardware (this is what I use! http://www.waves.com/content.aspx?id=327), then a subwoofer wont have a lot to do. But most modern recordings from the late 1990's will. Put on a CD recorded prior to about 1993 and then put a CD of a similiar style of music recorded recently. You'll pick the difference.

[ProjectIS]

Hi Akuma,

I couldn't agree with Sapphires statement more.

I had this same discussion with a mate a while ago. The sub in our ML systems is doing exactly what it needs to do. As long as you have the low frequency in your track, the sub will respond quite well. An easy way to create a response demo is author a baseline in software called "Fruityloops". It is bulk easy to use and you can create different beats utiliseing different low frequency instruments such as drums etc. Just author a baseline with no high treble stuff to confuse what you are hearing. I think you willl be suprised with what the sub can handle and produce. Burn your project onto a CD and give it ago.

You can download the demo here. Not sure if the demo will let you burn though. Im sure someone you know will let you try their copy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <_<

FL Studios

I think from memory Cevu messed around with an aftermarket sub. Without introducing a new amp, the results weren't quite there! ( I think thats what he said)!!

[last1]

Akuma,

The rear view mirror in my car shakes nearly every time I have the volume turned up, and it's not uncommon for people to look my way when the base is "pumping". I have my presets, bass and treble, set at their default settings.

The only time I'm dissapointed is if I've ripped the music onto a CD and the rip itself was ripped/compressed badly by whoever had done the ripping/compressing in the first place.

What isn't doing it for you? Radio/CD or both?

[Sapphire Cam]

As a postscript gents, 'last1' alludes to another issue.... Standard run-of-the-mill encoding MP3 software out there is pretty ordinary and takes away a fair bit of the deep end. That's essentially what MP3ing sound does - takes away frequencies at the very bottom (under say 100Hz) and very top (say above 15kHz), as well as removing some frequency bands in the middle, that the human ear will notice least if removed. This is how it can compress a song substantially (up to 90% of its original file size).

So if you are playing MP3s, you will notice less sub-bass - however you can compensate for this by encoding at a higher rate (say 256 instead of 128) or buying a good encoder, which does a much better job at encoding to ensure as much of the original frequency range is kept.

[akuma]

So it's a no no :(

Ohhh well ...

How about changing the standard 10" sub to a better sub?

[pygothian]

I am pretty sure a lot of you would think that the standard 10" subwoofer has no bass what so ever, and i'm pretty sure there have been many discussions about changing to a better subwoofer.

My question is who has done it in this forum and could someone please take some pics and show us? Any suggestions on the various options to choose from?

I've heard people left the standard sub and put another 12" sub + mono amp before. :P

I'm not sure if you are referring to the prestige sound system or the mark levinson in the sports luxury. I have the SL ML system in my IS250 and I think the bass is the best i have heard in any premium sound system. I own a merc C63 AMG, previously had a M3 and an RS4 and the Lexus sound absolute blows them out of the water. It is crisp, clarity is amazing and the bass makes my stomach rumble and the entire seats and review mirrow rumble and vibrate when I have my music playing even at the volume of 25. When I crank it to 40 or above it gives my insides a deep thumbing and I can feel my legs of my pants getting thumped by the bass. Cars parked next to me at red lights look at me because they can hear the deep bass rumbling.

Personally I think it is the best car sound system I've heard, and is up there with my 7.2 HD $60k home theatre sound system.

Maybe you are not listening to music that is well mastered or has poor bass in it.

Try crank up some metallica, or a bit of linkin park - and you wont be able to see anything in the review mirrow as it is vibrating too much. I'm scared to go past 45 on the volume as it gets painful on my insides.

I have the bass 2 notches past the midline, treble one slot up and DSP on in the sound settings, with the rear one slot back on on the image of the car position in the sound settings. I also use 5.1 dvd music discs that might contribute to the impact. However lots of mp3s I play via my ipod intergration sound pretty damn impressive. Not a single person who has been in the car has been disappointed - infact they have been convinced to by a lexus of the BMW purely because of the ML sound system.

[Jasper]

The ML system is outstanding. Try putting on a DVD Audio disc - Legion of Boom by Crystal Method for example. Crank it up to 45 and you'll really feel some bass.

The only disappointment for me is you can't force stereo, and the centre speaker it too dominant - there is no way to turn it down/off other than a physical disconnection.

[DANSLEX]

A lot of the bass is dependant on the track itself. Some tracks are either not recorded with proper bass line or are badly compressed. Most of Pendulum tracks sound awesome on the ML, for example Sounds of Life past 1 minute mark, the bass gets insane. Was the track I used to compare to my mate's stereo in his brand new E class. Let's just say he was depressed after that haha.

One problem I find with the sound system (and it's probably just my car), is that once I crank it up too much (or even half way), some speakers crackle. I'm guessing it's the plastic covering, as when I touch it and push it, the crackling stops. Does anyone else have this problem? Thinking of taking it in under warranty...

[ProjectIS]

I thought that I did when I first bought the car....... Was quite disappointed........ then I quickly realised that it was only the stuff that I had in the door console that was vibrating from the base!!

Mate, I would take it back to get fixed as I don't have any grill rattles! (yet)!!

My center speaker grill plate isn't quite flush with the dash, but I haven't noticed any rattles from it.

Let us all know how you get on (if you do), and what they actually did to re-secure them!!

[DANSLEX]

Yeah will do. Service is due in about 3 months time, I'll get them to look over it then. It gets annoying sometimes. Drivers side door also squeeks a little when you grab the handle. New ones don't.

Got a few more rattles to fix as well, something squeeks lots around the rear parcel shelf on a hot day. Obviously somehting is expanding due to heat and making a lot of noise. I try to avoid giving people lifts on a hot day, as it is embarassing to have a Lexus do that, it's quite loud!

All in all, nothing major, but there's a few rough edges with the car unfortuantely. Got about a year left till the warranty expires, need to get these things sorted prior to that :P

[ProjectIS]

Yeh mate, make sure you do. If you have the 06 model, get as many of the known rattles fixed whilst under warranty! I haven't heard of the rear parcel shelf problem before!!!

Look, I've got the 08 build and I must say that I am pretty lucky that they have improved on most of the known faults!! Good luck with it!!! ;)

(Still......all in all, we all have damn nice rides)!!!

[Sapphire Cam]

DANSLEX - I had the same problem (04/2006 build). There is a little plastic lug in the back pillar somewhere that may become slightly misaligned over time and will go undetected, until in warm weather when it expands ever so slightly and rubs on the lining, causing a slight squeak when direct sun shines on it for some time.

I mentioned this to my dealer last service, and yep, they knew right away what I meant, and how to fix it - which they did.

[FrankyX]

I love this topic! The ML is the best system I have ever had in a car and I have spent some serious $$$ on previous systems. C'mon, 14 speakers, you can't go wrong.

Yes DANSLEX, all Pendulum tracks sound awesome, especially Propane Nightmares and i'm not a huge D&B fan.

Other great sounding album recommendations; Pink Floyd - Pulse & anything by Soilwork.

[DANSLEX]

Ah, cheers for that! Will be easier explaining it to them, especially in winter time when there is no heat haha. It's gotta be the same thing, my car's build is 02/06.

The speaker grilles, I think perhaps the bolts or whatever have come loose over time, so maybe they just need tightening. I'll let them sort it out.

[BIGW]

Most music-heads dont appreciate this, but a good car audio system should have speakers matched with not only each other, but also the amplifier and the nature of the cabin.

How do you do this?

The subwoofer in the is250 has a very tight and balanced response and complements the standard woofers well, which actually if you listen arent as prominent out of the rear as the front, beacuse of what the sub is doing. If you want to go ahead and get one of those "fully sik hetik" massive loud subwoofers, go ahead, but you'll be compromising the overall sound quality of your system, and invariably will end up with a more murky and delayed bass response.

This inst necessarily true though, I have a Hertz Air Mille 5400 21" woofer in my car, i reckon it sounds ok. One of my friends has 2 Cerwin Vega Stroker 15" woofers in an aperiodic membrane in his M3. He has won a national title in the old days of IASCA sound quality competitions. There are just too many factors involved to get bass right as to just sum it up as a bigger woofer will ruin your SQ. And it is possible to have really tight LOW bass with a 15" woofer. I have proven this a number of times. One in particular collecting quite a number of trophies along the way.

I can agree to some point, the stock stereo is one of the NICER sounding stereos. But like everything it has its limits ans is aimed at the masses.

I find the woofer lacks low end extension and is practically non existent with the low notes. (A pitfall of ANY free air woofer)

Not much tone in it either, but you know it's there.

The fronts are way too laid back but give great mid bass response.

The fronts could do with a bit more snap up higher, and I'm not talking boosting treble, just lacking detail.

Sound stage is not too bad, but stock tweeter positions could do with some tweaking (some just by adjusting angle behind grille) but would be better mounted low in the kick panels.

Imaging isn't too flash though especially with live recordings.

Hence why I have pulled all the stock gear out.

One thing I do agree on is the recording, it can be quite damaging putting in your favourite CD into a nice high end system, hoping to expect sonic nirvana, only to hear dodging mix downs.

But there are still some great Cd's out there, Tool for example is recorded in 5.1 not much good for a car but still sounds fantastic!

[kinjiru]

The ML system is outstanding. Try putting on a DVD Audio disc - Legion of Boom by Crystal Method for example. Crank it up to 45 and you'll really feel some bass.

The only disappointment for me is you can't force stereo, and the centre speaker it too dominant - there is no way to turn it down/off other than a physical disconnection.

Somewhat late in the day, but I have to agree with Jasper's comment.

The ML system is great. I've listened to a fair few stock car audio systems and am very impressed by the ML system in the IS250. The Bose sound systems I have listened to are generally terrible! To my ears, only Volvo's Dynaudio 12 speaker system is better.

And as Jasper said, I wish I could turn down my centre speaker as well, but I don't want to start hacking into the wiring of the car.

[akuma]

Maybe i'm just expecting too much, at lease more bass. I guess I can't compare it with my old JL 12" + mono amp.

[Boeky72]

The ML system is outstanding. Try putting on a DVD Audio disc - Legion of Boom by Crystal Method for example. Crank it up to 45 and you'll really feel some bass.

The only disappointment for me is you can't force stereo, and the centre speaker it too dominant - there is no way to turn it down/off other than a physical disconnection.

I second Jaspers suggestion of playing The Crystal Method in the ML system. Its not unusual to hear me playing The Crystal Methods "Name of the Game" at 45+ with the windows up. A Lexus, ML sound system and a quality artist is all you need to reach great heights! - Do it!

[kinjiru]

The ML system is outstanding. Try putting on a DVD Audio disc - Legion of Boom by Crystal Method for example. Crank it up to 45 and you'll really feel some bass.

The only disappointment for me is you can't force stereo, and the centre speaker it too dominant - there is no way to turn it down/off other than a physical disconnection.

I second Jaspers suggestion of playing The Crystal Method in the ML system. Its not unusual to hear me playing The Crystal Methods "Name of the Game" at 45+ with the windows up. A Lexus, ML sound system and a quality artist is all you need to reach great heights! - Do it!

One thing I have noticed from the ML system is that the sound of MP3's playing is inferior to the same MP3 being subsequently converted to CD Audio format and played. I'm talking about EXACTLY THE SAME MP3 here. Seems to me that the MP3 decoder on the ML system has been implemented poorly. I've read that other owners of ML systems have noticed it too.

[Turbo4]

Nothing like the ML sound system, just a brilliant piece of kit.

I didn't truly appreciate how good it was until I stopped playing burnt CD's, and started playing one's properly store-bought and thus properly mastered without cheap compression tools.

I've had 5K setups (including front horns) in other cars i've owned and they haven't sounded near as crisp and punchy as the standard ML system does. The ML system would have been good enough to win more than it's fair share of audio store 'sound offs' only 10 years ago, and would still contend nowadays.

[Bartek]

OK now my turn ;)

The Mark Levinson audio system is a well configured and matched set to the IS250 interior. Of course - there are other options available to put in to this car but then again - ML and Lexus spent lots of time on matching the perfect configuration to whatever is required in a premium car audio system. I personally don't believe 14 speakers + the original sub is bad. The system sounds good and the bass levels are correct. Yes sure you can put a different sub and an amp to all that but the question is WHY?It would spoil the original configuration that makes the system play so well. If you want to do that - check all the frequency responses on speakers to match the sub to them the best possible way. Having spent lots of time exploring the audio and technical side of audio systems, I personally consider ML audio system as one of the best and clean sounding configurations so far and I would not change any component in the system. Companies like ML, HK, Marantz, B&W, Dynaudio invest lots of time and money in their technologies and are considered to be market leaders in sound development, the purification of sound.

[jeso]

A bit off topic here but sub related.

My sub seems to be producing a rattle sound.

I only noticed it when i had my head in the boot, although on certain songs

eg, Put on - Jeezy ft Kanye i can notice a distortion of bass from rear sub

on big bass tones.

Now i thought my sub had blown and took it to an audio store this afternoon.

The guy said it has not blown but maybe something is interfering or loose wire etc

Has anyone had a similar issue, ive searched thru CL and my.is forums to no avail.

[ProjectIS]

Search this forum!!! You will find a post on this!

Obviously I don't know exactly what your rattle sounds like but my sub exhibited the same symptoms. Can you notice it at low levels??

My sub ended up being faulty!!!!

Jeso, might be a grill like some have experienced, may be a defective driver ...................If you not sure, take it into Lexus service if you are still covered under warranty.